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IDProjectCategoryView StatusDate SubmittedLast Update
0000033Dwarf FortressCombat -- Generalpublic2010-04-01 15:482014-11-25 22:59
Reporternichaey 
Assigned ToToady One 
PriorityhighSeveritymajorReproducibilityhave not tried
StatusresolvedResolutionfixed 
PlatformOSOS Version
Product Version 
Target VersionFixed in Version0.40.01 
Summary0000033: Bronze colossus, skeletal creatures, fleshballs, and others are impossible to kill
DescriptionI assume that if 4 legendary axedwarfs with adamantium battleaxes cannot destroy a creature, then something is broken :P

I have a bronze collosus with all parts of its body "cut open" and "broken" and its feet hands ears and nose cut off, but it will not die

and I have a grimeling with all parts of its body "cut open" and "broken" and "bruised" its feet, hand, leg, arm and face fat cut off.
*note* the grimeling weight status is now "incredibly skinny", awesome :P
Steps To Reproduce
Additional Information
Tagsattack, bleeding, colossus, combat, death, undead
Relationships
related to 0000697new  Invincible Dwarves with Speed-Heal 
related to 0001534new  Broken/mangled limbs/joints can still be used for walking, attacking, flying 
related to 0000833resolved Footkerchief Adamantine bolts do less damage, bolts ineffective in general 
related to 0002872new  Dwarf child walking around with intestines outside of body -- disembowelment not fatal 
parent of 0000625resolved Toady One Flesh Balls 
parent of 0000692resolved Toady One Extended Combat with Zombie Giant Eagle 
parent of 0000721resolved Toady One Mortal wounds frequently don't kill, hearts/throats barely bleed, disembowelment rare 
parent of 0001292resolved Toady One Eyes can't be gouged out 
parent of 0001297resolved Toady One Eye injuries always heal, don't cause vision impairment 
parent of 0002327resolved Toady One Blunt weapons extremely ineffective, extended single combat with groundhog 
has duplicate 0000356resolved Footkerchief Creatures (especially dwarves) sometimes impossible to kill. 
has duplicate 0001013closed Footkerchief Undead Unkillable 
has duplicate 0002348resolved Logical2u Ocean Steam Titan unkillable, impotent 
related to 0001110resolved Toady One impact yield and impact fracture the same for all metals, unbalances combat 
related to 0000723resolved Toady One Projectiles that stick-in bleed until removed, and bleed forever if they stick in cheeks, fingers, etc., with no kill credit 
related to 0000307new  No announcements for blistering/charring, and other fire-related problems 
related to 0000023resolved Toady One Bite attacks frequently glance away or are generally ineffective 
related to 0004058new  Forgotten Beasts/Demons of certain materials are far too weak. 
related to 0000344resolved Toady One Knockback/"propelled away by the force of the blow" only happens rarely (same with throwing creatures any distance) 
related to 0000532resolved Toady One The fighter skill appears to have a negative affect. 
related to 0002115resolved Toady One Broken bones cause too much pain regardless of size 
related to 0000701new  When a numbered tooth is knocked out, all the other teeth in its "numbering group" can no longer be used for biting attacks 
related to 0000183new  Weapons get stuck into toes, eyelids, and teeth 
related to 0003908resolved Footkerchief Hitting person with silver maul is far weaker than just punching him 
related to 0003196confirmed Footkerchief Weapon deflections are credited to the outermost layer of armor, even if an inner layer did the work 
related to 0002633confirmed Footkerchief Elven wooden swords have same sharpness as normal wood, defeated by simple clothes 
related to 0002712new  weapons, especially whips, cut through steel armor like butter 
related to 0005195resolved Toady One invincible zombie swan 
related to 0005511resolved Toady One Undead/zombies/reanimated survive magma and fire indefinitely 
related to 0005245confirmed Footkerchief The smaller the creature, the more easily it bleeds to death from dismemberment, burns, etc. 
related to 0005312resolved Toady One Undead reanimate too quickly 
Attached Files
Issue History
Date ModifiedUsernameFieldChange
2010-04-01 15:48nichaeyNew Issue
2010-04-01 17:39YossitaruNote Added: 0000043
2010-04-01 17:57YossitaruIssue Monitored: Yossitaru
2010-04-01 18:09danteNote Added: 0000054
2010-04-01 18:16DoctorZuberNote Added: 0000060
2010-04-01 18:57KanddakNote Added: 0000069
2010-04-01 19:17DoctorZuberNote Added: 0000071
2010-04-01 19:24GauphastusNote Added: 0000074
2010-04-01 19:26SirPenguinNote Added: 0000075
2010-04-01 19:30SirPenguinNote Added: 0000076
2010-04-01 19:30GauphastusNote Added: 0000077
2010-04-01 19:31GauphastusNote Edited: 0000077bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0000077#r19
2010-04-01 19:32GauphastusNote Edited: 0000077bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0000077#r20
2010-04-01 19:32GauphastusNote Edited: 0000077bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0000077#r21
2010-04-02 00:05monkeyfetusNote Added: 0000122
2010-04-02 00:27nichaeyNote Added: 0000126
2010-04-02 00:43monkeyfetusNote Added: 0000133
2010-04-02 06:05TodestoolTag Attached: combat
2010-04-02 08:40YossitaruNote Added: 0000188
2010-04-02 09:19MaltayNote Added: 0000196
2010-04-02 13:24NihilistNote Added: 0000280
2010-04-02 13:25NihilistNote Edited: 0000280bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0000280#r70
2010-04-02 14:09AmpersandNote Added: 0000289
2010-04-02 14:36AmpersandNote Edited: 0000289bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0000289#r72
2010-04-02 16:45YossitaruNote Added: 0000335
2010-04-03 08:41TobiasNote Added: 0000532
2010-04-03 11:00RiceMunkNote Added: 0000581
2010-04-03 17:42Lightning4Note Added: 0000724
2010-04-03 18:50AnotherNote Added: 0000742
2010-04-04 13:42FootkerchiefRelationship addedparent of 0000356
2010-04-05 12:31FootkerchiefSummaryTwo broken creatures => Bronze colossus, skeletal creatures, and others are impossible to kill
2010-04-05 12:37InsanityPreludeNote Added: 0001167
2010-04-05 12:38InsanityPreludeNote Edited: 0001167bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0001167#r367
2010-04-05 13:14FrumpleNote Added: 0001181
2010-04-06 01:47Azrael KaineNote Added: 0001384
2010-04-06 09:36FootkerchiefRelationship addedparent of 0000625
2010-04-06 09:58JusticeIssue Monitored: Justice
2010-04-06 12:50FootkerchiefSummaryBronze colossus, skeletal creatures, and others are impossible to kill => Bronze colossus, skeletal creatures, fleshballs, and others are impossible to kill
2010-04-06 12:50FootkerchiefSticky IssueNo => Yes
2010-04-07 00:00FootkerchiefSummaryBronze colossus, skeletal creatures, fleshballs, and others are impossible to kill => Bronze colossus, skeletal creatures, fleshballs, and others are impossible to kill; other creatures are totally ineffective
2010-04-07 00:01FootkerchiefRelationship addedparent of 0000692
2010-04-07 00:31caldfirNote Added: 0001700
2010-04-07 03:27FootkerchiefRelationship addedparent of 0000697
2010-04-07 04:18RiceMunkIssue Monitored: RiceMunk
2010-04-07 04:32king doomTag Attached: colossus
2010-04-07 04:32king doomTag Attached: bleeding
2010-04-07 04:32king doomTag Attached: attack
2010-04-07 04:33king doomTag Attached: death
2010-04-07 05:04G-FlexNote Added: 0001724
2010-04-07 05:59Village IdiotNote Added: 0001727
2010-04-07 10:02FishofMuuNote Added: 0001771
2010-04-07 10:18Adamantine FistNote Added: 0001779
2010-04-07 10:29FootkerchiefRelationship addedparent of 0000721
2010-04-07 15:53FootkerchiefSummaryBronze colossus, skeletal creatures, fleshballs, and others are impossible to kill; other creatures are totally ineffective => Bronze colossus, skeletal creatures, fleshballs, and others are impossible to kill; bite attacks are frequently ineffective
2010-04-07 15:53FootkerchiefRelationship addedparent of 0000744
2010-04-07 16:09KwahnNote Added: 0001878
2010-04-08 11:27SkibilianoIssue Monitored: Skibiliano
2010-04-08 12:20CaptainFailmoreNote Added: 0002118
2010-04-08 12:48toybasherNote Added: 0002129
2010-04-08 15:12SquirrelloidNote Added: 0002168
2010-04-08 15:13SquirrelloidNote Edited: 0002168bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0002168#r657
2010-04-08 15:35SirPenguinNote Added: 0002176
2010-04-08 17:27bloodystumpIssue Monitored: bloodystump
2010-04-08 17:39supaIssue Monitored: supa
2010-04-08 17:55SirPenguinIssue Monitored: SirPenguin
2010-04-08 18:50FootkerchiefRelationship deletedparent of 0000744
2010-04-08 18:50FootkerchiefSummaryBronze colossus, skeletal creatures, fleshballs, and others are impossible to kill; bite attacks are frequently ineffective => Bronze colossus, skeletal creatures, fleshballs, and others are impossible to kill
2010-04-08 23:57flashzomIssue Monitored: flashzom
2010-04-09 03:38Khym ChanurIssue Monitored: Khym Chanur
2010-04-09 08:57jarvollIssue Monitored: jarvoll
2010-04-09 11:35martinNote Added: 0002366
2010-04-10 22:16simrobertIssue Monitored: simrobert
2010-04-11 10:23Darkfire7777Issue Monitored: Darkfire7777
2010-04-11 10:43darkfredNote Added: 0002835
2010-04-11 10:44darkfredIssue Monitored: darkfred
2010-04-11 11:33Demaster72Issue Monitored: Demaster72
2010-04-11 13:11FootkerchiefRelationship addedhas duplicate 0001013
2010-04-11 15:15MaDeR LevapIssue Monitored: MaDeR Levap
2010-04-11 18:22FootkerchiefRelationship addedparent of 0001021
2010-04-12 10:12bduerstNote Added: 0003074
2010-04-12 11:37DoubNote Added: 0003091
2010-04-12 18:54smjjamesNote Added: 0003176
2010-04-12 19:07smjjamesNote Edited: 0003176bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0003176#r1029
2010-04-12 21:23JumppNote Added: 0003199
2010-04-12 21:23JumppNote Deleted: 0003199
2010-04-13 06:35lucasupNote Added: 0003243
2010-04-13 07:58MisterstoneNote Added: 0003254
2010-04-13 11:19smjjamesTag Attached: undead
2010-04-13 12:41madjoe5Issue Monitored: madjoe5
2010-04-13 13:21UberNubeNote Added: 0003314
2010-04-13 20:46InsanityPreludeIssue Monitored: InsanityPrelude
2010-04-14 12:36lord_chaos22000Issue Monitored: lord_chaos22000
2010-04-14 21:15user891Note Added: 0003618
2010-04-15 00:02G-FlexNote Added: 0003632
2010-04-15 23:55NimrodNote Added: 0003809
2010-04-16 00:06ArkaaitoIssue Monitored: Arkaaito
2010-04-16 00:45TKTomIssue Monitored: TKTom
2010-04-16 19:40RandomnumbergeneratorNote Added: 0003932
2010-04-16 19:51RandomnumbergeneratorIssue Monitored: Randomnumbergenerator
2010-04-18 01:54FelcisNote Added: 0004024
2010-04-18 07:04UberNubeIssue Monitored: UberNube
2010-04-18 07:48AnotherNote Added: 0004050
2010-04-18 07:49AnotherNote Edited: 0004050bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0004050#r1351
2010-04-18 07:52AnotherIssue Monitored: Another
2010-04-18 08:48CubittusIssue Monitored: Cubittus
2010-04-18 12:22FootkerchiefRelationship addedparent of 0001292
2010-04-18 12:22FootkerchiefRelationship addedparent of 0001297
2010-04-18 12:25ntpIssue Monitored: ntp
2010-04-18 15:34maximusfiveIssue Monitored: maximusfive
2010-04-20 21:42nocashIssue Monitored: nocash
2010-04-21 04:40HazelrahBLIssue Monitored: HazelrahBL
2010-04-21 06:11SpectreIssue Monitored: Spectre
2010-04-21 12:25LlamaNote Added: 0004490
2010-04-22 16:26shoezNote Added: 0004649
2010-04-24 12:02FelcisNote Added: 0004907
2010-04-29 13:31FootkerchiefCategoryGeneral => Combat -- General
2010-04-30 22:41FootkerchiefRelationship addedparent of 0001534
2010-05-01 05:04Jiri PetruNote Added: 0005811
2010-05-04 10:13caldfirNote Added: 0006093
2010-05-05 12:39toybasherNote Added: 0006202
2010-05-05 13:44EverardXavierIssue Monitored: EverardXavier
2010-05-05 18:23SkandrakenIssue Monitored: Skandraken
2010-05-07 23:15JeffGrovesNote Added: 0006399
2010-05-08 02:56Jiri PetruNote Added: 0006403
2010-05-08 13:51toybasherNote Added: 0006425
2010-05-20 06:37AnotherNote Added: 0007068
2010-05-20 09:24derigoNote Added: 0007074
2010-05-21 04:39AnotherNote Added: 0007123
2010-05-23 14:53toybasherNote Added: 0007223
2010-05-23 14:54toybasherNote Added: 0007224
2010-05-26 04:15toybasherNote Added: 0007339
2010-05-26 09:24FootkerchiefNote Added: 0007343
2010-05-26 11:43toybasherNote Added: 0007347
2010-05-26 11:43toybasherNote Deleted: 0007339
2010-05-26 11:45toybasherNote Edited: 0007224bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0007224#r2758
2010-06-02 04:33B0015Issue Monitored: B0015
2010-06-04 13:30Hieronymous AlloyIssue Monitored: Hieronymous Alloy
2010-06-05 11:49leetmaster4004Issue Monitored: leetmaster4004
2010-06-07 02:18lucasupIssue Monitored: lucasup
2010-06-08 00:14CelIssue Monitored: Cel
2010-06-10 10:13NikinyoNote Added: 0008056
2010-06-10 10:38QuietustNote Added: 0008060
2010-06-11 06:34Kyle_SoloIssue Monitored: Kyle_Solo
2010-06-12 10:56KurikIssue Monitored: Kurik
2010-06-13 14:30Kyle_SoloNote Added: 0008326
2010-06-14 05:02LangdonIssue Monitored: Langdon
2010-06-14 10:38smjjamesNote Added: 0008418
2010-06-14 10:39smjjamesIssue Monitored: smjjames
2010-06-14 10:55smjjamesNote Edited: 0008418bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0008418#r3216
2010-06-14 10:58smjjamesNote Edited: 0008418bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0008418#r3217
2010-06-14 13:49ContiIssue Monitored: Conti
2010-06-14 13:53FootkerchiefRelationship replacedhas duplicate 0000356
2010-06-14 13:55FootkerchiefRelationship addedparent of 0002327
2010-06-15 17:37Logical2uRelationship addedhas duplicate 0002348
2010-06-20 09:13FootkerchiefRelationship addedrelated to 0001110
2010-06-23 13:04izzyIssue Monitored: izzy
2010-06-23 13:35FootkerchiefRelationship addedparent of 0000264
2010-06-23 14:11QuietustNote Added: 0009024
2010-06-24 09:23QuietustNote Edited: 0009024bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0009024#r3467
2010-06-28 05:43Toady OneNote Added: 0009208
2010-06-28 05:43Toady OneAssigned To => Toady One
2010-06-28 05:43Toady OneStatusnew => acknowledged
2010-06-28 13:27MisterstoneNote Added: 0009265
2010-07-02 02:22ChickenLipsNote Added: 0009504
2010-07-02 02:26ChickenLipsNote Edited: 0009504bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0009504#r3659
2010-07-05 10:22FootkerchiefRelationship addedrelated to 0000723
2010-07-05 16:39FootkerchiefRelationship addedparent of 0000833
2010-07-07 17:49FootkerchiefRelationship deletedparent of 0000264
2010-07-07 17:49FootkerchiefRelationship addedrelated to 0000307
2010-07-11 10:01ProfligateIssue Monitored: Profligate
2010-07-11 14:30smjjamesNote Added: 0009961
2010-07-11 14:30smjjamesIssue End Monitor: smjjames
2010-07-14 08:25FootkerchiefRelationship addedrelated to 0000023
2010-07-14 13:43CatyrpeliusIssue Monitored: Catyrpelius
2010-07-25 14:19FootkerchiefRelationship replacedrelated to 0000697
2010-07-25 14:43FootkerchiefRelationship replacedrelated to 0000833
2010-07-25 14:44FootkerchiefRelationship deletedparent of 0001021
2010-07-26 05:53greycatNote Added: 0011068
2010-07-28 07:06RiceMunkNote Added: 0011183
2010-07-28 15:14FootkerchiefRelationship addedparent of 0002872
2010-08-02 21:47InsanityPreludeNote Added: 0011427
2010-08-03 09:05xrogaanIssue Monitored: xrogaan
2010-08-06 12:40greycatNote Added: 0011555
2010-08-17 01:38knofbathNote Added: 0011845
2010-08-21 12:38shoezIssue Monitored: shoez
2010-08-24 22:48kuketskiIssue Monitored: kuketski
2010-09-05 10:06KonNote Added: 0012424
2010-09-19 13:34vadiaNote Added: 0012824
2011-03-02 09:13FootkerchiefRelationship addedrelated to 0004058
2011-03-04 16:37FootkerchiefRelationship addedrelated to 0000344
2011-03-29 07:51Granite26Note Added: 0016761
2011-04-01 12:59FootkerchiefRelationship addedrelated to 0000532
2011-04-03 14:14FootkerchiefRelationship addedrelated to 0002115
2011-04-03 14:21KogutNote Added: 0017027
2011-04-04 10:49FootkerchiefRelationship addedrelated to 0000701
2011-05-09 09:22enlaitIssue Monitored: enlait
2011-05-09 13:29JorshamoNote Added: 0017673
2011-05-10 20:05trousermonkey1Issue Monitored: trousermonkey1
2011-05-10 20:05trousermonkey1Issue End Monitor: trousermonkey1
2012-02-20 17:46FootkerchiefRelationship addedrelated to 0000183
2012-02-20 18:55FootkerchiefRelationship addedrelated to 0003908
2012-02-20 18:56FootkerchiefRelationship addedrelated to 0003196
2012-02-20 19:09FootkerchiefRelationship addedrelated to 0002633
2012-02-20 19:11FootkerchiefRelationship addedrelated to 0002712
2012-02-23 09:27KogutNote Added: 0020547
2012-02-23 19:41LogicalDashNote Added: 0020581
2012-02-29 08:23FootkerchiefRelationship addedrelated to 0005195
2012-02-29 08:23FootkerchiefRelationship addedrelated to 0005511
2012-03-13 02:56G-FlexNote Added: 0021435
2012-03-23 05:01BuglistIssue Monitored: Buglist
2012-03-31 05:44thvazNote Added: 0021938
2012-03-31 07:40FootkerchiefNote Added: 0021940
2012-03-31 08:02thvazNote Added: 0021942
2012-03-31 08:04thvazNote Edited: 0021942bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0021942#r8163
2012-04-02 04:32KogutTag Attached: CLOSE THIS
2012-04-02 09:28FootkerchiefNote Added: 0022030
2012-04-02 09:47NW_KohakuNote Added: 0022031
2012-04-02 10:09KogutTag Detached: CLOSE THIS
2012-04-02 11:58FootkerchiefNote Added: 0022035
2013-12-07 04:32ThundercraftIssue Monitored: Thundercraft
2014-01-26 09:44FootkerchiefRelationship addedrelated to 0005245
2014-01-26 10:07FootkerchiefRelationship addedrelated to 0005312
2014-07-08 19:17sirdeimosNote Added: 0025215
2014-07-19 07:44thvazNote Added: 0026944
2014-07-21 05:11lethosorNote Added: 0027119
2014-07-21 06:26thvazNote Added: 0027126
2014-07-21 06:47thvazNote Added: 0027128
2014-07-21 06:48thvazNote Added: 0027129
2014-07-23 11:11thvazIssue Monitored: thvaz
2014-07-23 11:11thvazTag Attached: CLOSE THIS
2014-07-23 11:41SirPenguinNote Added: 0027337
2014-07-23 12:14thvazNote Added: 0027340
2014-07-23 12:17thvazNote Edited: 0027340bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0027340#r10260
2014-07-23 12:25thvazNote Edited: 0027340bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0027340#r10261
2014-07-26 19:07ArmokGoBNote Added: 0027659
2014-07-26 22:24SirPenguinNote Added: 0027672
2014-07-29 13:07Toady OneRelationship replacedrelated to 0002872
2014-07-29 13:07Toady OneRelationship replacedrelated to 0001534
2014-07-29 13:08Toady OneNote Added: 0027895
2014-07-29 13:08Toady OneStatusacknowledged => resolved
2014-07-29 13:08Toady OneFixed in Version => 0.40.01
2014-07-29 13:08Toady OneResolutionopen => fixed
2014-07-29 15:45thvazIssue End Monitor: thvaz
2014-07-30 13:13DwarfuTag Detached: CLOSE THIS
2014-08-05 16:53lethosorSticky IssueYes => No
2014-11-25 22:59InsanityPreludeIssue End Monitor: InsanityPrelude
2016-05-26 19:39ThundercraftIssue End Monitor: Thundercraft

Notes
(0000043)
Yossitaru   
2010-04-01 17:39   
I have the same issue with hammers on at least sasquatches and cougars. I keep bashing away and the thing doesn't die. I've fought two sasquatches and two cougars, three of which died after I damaged the brain. This second sasquatch is still alive despite injuring the heart, which is currently listed in red, along with the majority of the rest of her body.
(0000054)
dante   
2010-04-01 18:09   
I have had two bronze collosuses and two blizzard men duking it out against each other in Arena mode for the last half hour, at 100 FPS, and they're all completely yellow/red wounded and none of them are dying.
(0000060)
DoctorZuber   
2010-04-01 18:16   
sounds... FUN!
(0000069)
Kanddak   
2010-04-01 18:57   
That doesn't sound like a bug at all to me, let alone a major, high-priority one. Here's to megabeasts not sucking!
(0000071)
DoctorZuber   
2010-04-01 19:17   
Agreed... So... you're saying Titans are actually mightier than carp now? What's the problem?
(0000074)
Gauphastus   
2010-04-01 19:24   
Consider Yossitaru's note as well. This is happening to more than just megabeasts.
(0000075)
SirPenguin   
2010-04-01 19:26   
Bronze colossi and undead creatures are broken in the sense that they simply cannot die through combat. Both can die - for example, being dropped in magma - but not through combat.

For instance, my friend had a fort where his army of 7 dwarves fought with a group of skeletal goats for many seasons before they (the dwarves) died of starvation.

This is pretty major given that there's nothing that can be done in this case except sit back and die.
(0000076)
SirPenguin   
2010-04-01 19:30   
I'd like to confirm this also happens with blizzard men. If I had to hazard a guess, I'd say that creatures with non-traditional bodies (most likely creatures without blood or typical organs) have no true way of determining death. Whereas blood creatures can die when that value reaches 0, and creatures with organs can die when a certain number of important ones fail, creatures without any of those things don't know when they can die.
(0000077)
Gauphastus   
2010-04-01 19:30   
(edited on: 2010-04-01 19:32)
I was just now given a theory, that weapons (at least some) are unable to deliver killing blows.
Melting, drowning, bleeding out.. these things are all possible, but they're not strictly related to weapon kills.

The only weapon blow that does seem to kill is a shot to the brain.

What do you think? Can anyone back this up?

EDIT: Ninja'd by penguin. :O
(0000122)
monkeyfetus   
2010-04-02 00:05   
I suspect [SEVER_ON_BREAK] is currently broken.
(0000126)
nichaey   
2010-04-02 00:27   
@monkey fetus
maybe, but I did manage to sever the collosuses feet, hands, ears, and nose. So it might a more convoluted glitch.
(0000133)
monkeyfetus   
2010-04-02 00:43   
I think those severs were because those objects are small enough to be cut through by a sword, despite the strength of their material. On undead creatures at least, limbs are supposed to fall off when they become broken/shattered.
(0000188)
Yossitaru   
2010-04-02 08:40   
I think it would be appropriate to post this as evidence towards nothing but a brain hit being fatal to fleshy, living organics, as far as directly weapon related kills go.

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v662/Yos2/?action=view&current=SuperSassy.png [^]

In case you're not on top of the new wound colorings, blue indicates that the function of the listed item is completely disabled, but structurally intact. Anything with both lungs broken should have been dead long before this sasquatch died, which was twenty or so hits later when I finally did hit the brain.
(0000196)
Maltay   
2010-04-02 09:19   
It is impossible to kill bronze colossi and skeletal creatures in combat. Everything that can be severed is severed and everything else turns red. However, they never die. I had my starting 7 battle a skeletal gorilla overnight for 8 hrs. on 100 FPS. I had two bronze colossi battle one another in arena mode for 2 hrs. on 100 FPS.
(0000280)
Nihilist   
2010-04-02 13:24   
(edited on: 2010-04-02 13:25)
I have killed a bronze colossus by having two fight eachother in Arena mode weilding slade Two-hander swords. Cut its head off - death insued. Its hard to reproduce due to not being able to aim, but it seems they will die if their head is de-attached.
(0000289)
Ampersand   
2010-04-02 14:09   
(edited on: 2010-04-02 14:36)
The issue seems to be with the combat simulation. There ought to be some way that a bronze colossus may be made effectively harmless after being sufficiently mutilated, or else the simulation need be redone significantly, which I think is currently unreasonable to demand.

Edit: Testing various scenarios against BCs

I pit 36 Grandmaster Axeminotaurs against a single BC, with steel Greataxes.

The BC had both of it's arms chopped off at the shoulder, and both of it's feet cut off, where as dwarfs would only remove it's hands and feet at the ankles and wrists. This indicates that it is a matter of the simulation rather than the BC having a completely indestructible body.
(0000335)
Yossitaru   
2010-04-02 16:45   
Nihilist: I just went through an adventure as a swordsdwarf and I have found that sword can deliver killing blows in the form of decapitation and slicing into two (across the torso).

That potentially makes swords the most kill-able weapons currently, as it seems to sever most often (blood loss death), can decapitate and eviscerate, in addition to a brain shot kill.
(0000532)
Tobias   
2010-04-03 08:41   
I currently have a forgotten beast in my Wellshaft.
Its Head, Shell and legs are broken and smashed open. Its arms and feet are cut off. It just won't die, and keeps scaring my civilians. It is surrounded by the mutilated remains of my Militia.
I think I will have to wall it in.
(0000581)
RiceMunk   
2010-04-03 11:00   
Confirming that a bronze colossus can be killed by melty death as well. Had a bronze colossus go up against a couple dozen fire men. The colossus ended up turning all melted and dead.

Also had a forgotten beast stubbornly refuse to die on me in fortress mode despite having a bunch of axedwarves chopping away at it for most of a season.
(0000724)
Lightning4   
2010-04-03 17:42   
Also confirmed. I had been trying to kill the same bronze colossus in adventure mode for hours. My first adventurer shattered every single part of its body yet it did not die. That adventurer later died trying to wrestle it. Can't find any way of breaking joints anymore either, not that it would have any effect as it's already all mangled. Kept having to adjust grip and stuff.

I sent like six different adventurers armed with weapons ranging from fists to sasquatch corpses. Nothing worked. (though the sasquatch corpses were surprisingly effective at shattering it even more).

The most damage I ever managed to do was blowing off some fingers and toes.
(0000742)
Another   
2010-04-03 18:50   
I managed to wrestle a sasquatch to death with a naked skillless human once. The battle started with me standing at the same square as the lying sasquatch and I became legendary wrestler and fighter in the process. The sasquatch just kept breaking one of 3 my grasps at a time and the only damage I could do to it was by general punching. I could not wrestle-break any one of his fingers or get any damage done to eyes or eyelids with gouging or pinching.

My other human adventurer continued fighting for really very long time after his lungs were damaged by wrestling with elves and a red flashing "Mortal wound" appeared on the main status bar.
(0001167)
InsanityPrelude   
2010-04-05 12:37   
(edited on: 2010-04-05 12:38)
A few militiadwarves (I think one has an axe, the others are on "individual choice, melee" or crossbows) and fortress animals against a forgotten beast made of mud. Both wings were hacked off and the body red (apparently it has no innards?) but it wasn't showing any sign of giving up.

Its status screen showed "Its left wing is gone. Its right wing is gone." but nothing about the mangled status of its body.

On that note, it had no head to start with either, just a body and two wings. Is that normal?
(0001181)
Frumple   
2010-04-05 13:14   
Just to note it here -- it's been noted in much greater detail on the forum -- but it is possible to combat-kill a colossi or other non-organic creature, providing the weapon being used is both large enough (in some manner or another) and/or being wielded by a large enough creature. Dwarves and vanilla melee weapons can't manage it.

A GM Giant or Ettin with a slade greataxe or two-handed sword can combat kill a colossi, ferex. Modding experiments had solid HFS-stone glob breathers able to penetrate into and kill unkillable-by-any-other-dwarf-powered-weapon HFS critters.

Anyway, there's several topics on the forum that cover the issue in greater detail, but while combat definitely seems to be working-as-programmed, it's hopefully not working-as-intended. Unintended consequence rather than glitch... hopefully.
(0001384)
Azrael Kaine   
2010-04-06 01:47   
Falls will also smash colossi, did so in adventure mode by tricking it into sharging off a 4 storey cliff, didn't get credit for the kill though, unfortunately.
(0001700)
caldfir   
2010-04-07 00:31   
I just had a rather silly fight with a zombified giant eagle. The creature never managed to substantially injure any of my dwarves, however it took most of the fall to kill. I later determined the cause of death by noticing that its head was on the roof.

I have to say I was pleased that its corpse was labeled as "mangled" though.
(0001724)
G-Flex   
2010-04-07 05:04   
The problem here seems to stem from the fact that wounds cannot be exacerbated by other wounds, and do not seem to "stack" at all.

In other words, even if you can shatter the hell out of a part, shattering the hell out of it fifty billion times in a row will still not pulverize it into nothing, or sever it.

(similarly, a billion bruises don't result in the sort of mashed-up internal-bleeding tenderized-flesh nightmare it should, for the same reason, resulting in a dwarf being able to punch a wild animal until he dies of starvation without killing it)

More detailed info possibly here: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=52120.0 [^]
(0001727)
Village Idiot   
2010-04-07 05:59   
A bronze colossus can melt from dragonfire too, you just need several dragons at once for this to be effective or he will simply kill them.
(0001771)
FishofMuu   
2010-04-07 10:02   
A single dwarf with a slade 2h-sword can kill a BC in mere seconds, so the dwarves can definitely reach.
(0001779)
Adamantine Fist   
2010-04-07 10:18   
Killing any of these creatures involves severing an essential bodypart (for the most part, either the upper or lower body). This is very difficult, particularly with things like Bronze Colossi.
(0001878)
Kwahn   
2010-04-07 16:09   
You'd think shattering said bodypart would be alot like severing it... when I think of 'shattering' I think that it's just exploded into pieces. (which is dangerous in and of itself when dealing with something made of bronze...)
(0002118)
CaptainFailmore   
2010-04-08 12:20   
Confirming this also.

1. Sever on break does not work.

2. Only lethal severs, material destruction, and bleed-outs kill.

3. Impact weapons don't seem to generate any such wounds, only cutting weapons.

4. There does not appear to be any concept of general health expressed by any part of the simulation, which means inorganic creatures don't have a point where they just disintegrate or fail, and a large number of injuries won't eventually kill an organic creature. This is both inconvenient and, for those who care, highly unrealistic.

5. Entities currently do not flee combat when too injured to fight or exhausted; all fights are fights to the death, no exceptions. This is less a bug and more of an annoyance.
(0002129)
toybasher   
2010-04-08 12:48   
Also the mortal wounds ibe I made seems to be linked to this. I stabbed en ellf right through the heart and the bleeding wasnt fatal and stopped without even becomming faint.
(0002168)
Squirrelloid   
2010-04-08 15:12   
(edited on: 2010-04-08 15:13)
Come now, this is in proper Zombie-movie style. Thou canst kill that which doest not live. But you can blast it into chunky kibble. (We clearly need rocket launchers! And shotguns!)
(0002176)
SirPenguin   
2010-04-08 15:35   
I disagree with 5, CaptainFailmore. I've noticed more than ever many creatures running away when too injured. Indeed, I once had a trog that invaded my fort, got beaten up pretty badly, then retreated back into the caverns. Ironically he fled right into a giant cave spider web and my military caught up with him.

However, this doesn't seem to always happen. Notably, when between two creatures who seem to be locked into a fight with no victor, especially when against the undead.
(0002366)
martin   
2010-04-09 11:35   
I think the behavior is mostly okay for zombies (cranking through quite a lot of them in DFM3) but they pretty nearly require a proper beheading to kill. Doing that to a zombie GCS is nigh impossible (even with 10 axedwarves working on it). They should be able to soldier on just fine with limbs missing and all that (and the GCS did do that) as bleeding out doesn't make sense in this context, but I'd say once you hit a red brain injury they ought to go down. That'd also allow non-edged attacks to have some chance of success.

But yeah, fighting zombies is supposed to be overwhelmingly hard. That's the point.
(0002835)
darkfred   
2010-04-11 10:43   
Zombies are easy enough to kill with some axedwarves. The real problem is skeletal anything. Mountain goats, marmots, pity the fool who has a skeletal giant cave swallow. I have 4 legendary xedwarves who have been pounding on a skeletal mountain goat for years. I think the problem is that once all the limbs
are red, the axes can do no more damage. Which is the root of the problem.

I have killed a couple skeletal animals, if you manage to get a lucky shot in before all the limbs turn red you can kill them. Once the limbs are red your fort is basically doomed since the beast is now unkillable.
(0003074)
bduerst   
2010-04-12 10:12   
I have several zombie deer and zombie raccoons that refuse to die as well. I've been hacking at them with axes and tearing off limbs and heads, but they just don't die. How can a huge zombie raccoon keep fighting with it's head several tiles over?

Also, the zombie deer emitted deer pus everywhere outside, which is still there several years and rainstorms later. The zombie deer pus is now being trampled into my fortress >_<
(0003091)
Doub   
2010-04-12 11:37   
Skeletal creatures can also be killed by capturing them with a cagetrap and then drop them off a high cliff.
(0003176)
smjjames   
2010-04-12 18:54   
(edited on: 2010-04-12 19:07)
Just checked in .03, fleshballs are still impossible to kill, at least by brute force from a bronze collossus.

Edit: Made a bronze collossus with a <redacted> (not the light one, the heavy one) two handed sword and that killed it, so I guess edged weapons as usual work best against zombies?
(0003243)
lucasup   
2010-04-13 06:35   
I have a salt blob beast. Merchants were able to hack its wings and stinger off. It has an invincible red body though. Its been killing off migrants/merchants and stalking around the entrance of my fort. I've updated to .03 (moved over the raws to the save file too) and it still seems to be unkillable. I did a test and let it into my fort of 100+ and it never died. Maybe if I had some swords/axes I could do something.
(0003254)
Misterstone   
2010-04-13 07:58   
In the arena it seems that skeletons immersed in magma still do not die. I wonder if their magical invisible tissue layer insulates them from the heat?

When I dropped a skeletal unicorn into magma, it smoked for a bit, but after at least 60 seconds on 100 frame/sec it had only yellow wound status on all parts.

I am surprised bone doesn't just go "poof" into a cloud of smoke, but I guess there are different processes in place for living critters taking damage from intense heat and objects made from bone.
(0003314)
UberNube   
2010-04-13 13:21   
Just got this in the latest version with 2 inorganic Forgotten Beasts which simply refuse to die. One had it's wings cut off and it's body (the only other part) broken, cut and bruised yet it wouldn't die. The other had 3 of its legs, its upper/lower body and its head smashed and broken, yet it didn't even seem to be slowed down.

I suspect the problem is that dwarf fortress is now too realistic, and accurately simulates the fact that a giant creature made from magically-animated metal can't be killed by conventional melee weapons.
(0003618)
user891   
2010-04-14 21:15   
WTB magic weapons.
(0003632)
G-Flex   
2010-04-15 00:02   
"I am surprised bone doesn't just go "poof" into a cloud of smoke, but I guess there are different processes in place for living critters taking damage from intense heat and objects made from bone."

That isn't the issue, I'm afraid.

The issue is that tissues on fire never, ever, ever burn away. They just stay on fire forever, without accumulating further injury or crumbling.
(0003809)
Nimrod   
2010-04-15 23:55   
"A great humanoid composed of crystal glass" just walzed right through 20 of my toughest soldiers and all my dogs. He has about every part smashed open, cut open, broken or missing but still hes coming on... and killing on his way.
(0003932)
Randomnumbergenerator   
2010-04-16 19:40   
It seems that inorganic creatures with just a "body"(no upper/lower body + head like Bronze Colossi) can't be killed at all, since they have no vital anything. At least with inorganic humanoids like Bronze Colossi and certain Titans/HFS, they can be decapitated or split in two(though it is still incredibly difficult, and almost impossible in fortress mode). But because you can't carve a single part in half, they're completely invincible.
(0004024)
Felcis   
2010-04-18 01:54   
I had the same problem with a forgotten beast which was "composed of vomit" (http://www.npshare.de/files/1a59c1ae/DF%20Forgotten%20Beast%202.jpg [^] ). More than 5 Elite Soldiers with different weapons (Hammers, Axes, Swords, Spears) quickly crippled it (all feet lopped of and everything else red) but it wouldn´t die and was still moving and killing animals/civillians like before.
(0004050)
Another   
2010-04-18 07:48   
(edited on: 2010-04-18 07:49)
I suspended paying DF until I have a chance against Shade Banshees and Grey Banshees. 2 wings and a body composed of ash. Wings easily lopped off, body painted red.

"The militia commander hacks The Shade Banshee in the body with his (silver battle axe), breaking away the rest of the tissue!
The Axe Lord hacks The Shade Banshee in the body with his (copper battle axe), breaking away the rest of the tissue!"

They should be dead after that but continue to attack my dwarves after hundreds of such messages.

I can provide a save if needed. Version 0.31.03.
(0004490)
Llama   
2010-04-21 12:25   
I have had a problem with a forgotten beast composed of a 'body' and a 'shell'. 2 war elephants and 2 war dogs ripped the shell off and got the body to red in 1 real minute. It has been around 1.5 IG years now and its still fighting.
(0004649)
shoez   
2010-04-22 16:26   
Does anyone know of a workaround? A way to remove the creature from a fortress by editing raws? Changing the creatures so that they have normal body parts?
(0004907)
Felcis   
2010-04-24 12:02   
Well, having a tame dragon can really help...
(0005811)
Jiri Petru   
2010-05-01 05:04   
The only possible workaround I can think of, and that I haven't tried, would be to use DF Hack to create a square of magma on top of the creature! Everyone nearby would probably burn too.
(0006093)
caldfir   
2010-05-04 10:13   
On top of being unkillable, Colossi also do extremely weak damage. My dwarves died of thirst before the thing could kill them. Did some unpleasant looking wounds, but never managed to remove any body parts or cause lethal bleeding.

The result is essentially that the fort was unplayable but didn't get eliminated outright. Rather frustrating.
(0006202)
toybasher   
2010-05-05 12:39   
aye, In adventure mode I went to a demonic fortress and faced a "tear devil" he only had a body and two wings. I was unable to kill him even tho it says "breaking away the rest of the tissue" I bet money sever on breaks is borked.
(0006399)
JeffGroves   
2010-05-07 23:15   
Had a similar issue against a Desert Titan made of snow. Both wings broken off, body completely red, 167 pages of "X hits it in the body, breaking off the rest of the tissue!"

It also seemed like it did less damage than it should. It only got 2-3 kills in about a half-season of fighting.
(0006403)
Jiri Petru   
2010-05-08 02:56   
Someone at Something Awful suggested you use DFhack to create magma in the square with the creature, and then create water on the square above. The creature should solidify into obsidian, no matter if it is magma resistant or not.
(0006425)
toybasher   
2010-05-08 13:51   
yes, breaking away rest of tissue means basicly you smashed his body apart and it should kill him, but I guess sever on breaks makes it so he wont die.


Even more frustrating, they can still push you and somhoe shatter bones and jam them thru organs thru armor.
(0007068)
Another   
2010-05-20 06:37   
I suspect that the relevant part of raws is this:
--------------------------------------------
[BODY:BASIC_1PARTBODY]
    Categories are user-defined strings that can be used elsewhere to refer to groups of bodyparts for other commands.
    [BP:UB:body:bodies][UPPERBODY][LOWERBODY][CATEGORY:BODY]
    This command establishes the relative size of body parts within a creature. The numbers have no absolute meaning or units.
        [DEFAULT_RELSIZE:2000]

[BODY:BASIC_1PARTBODY_THOUGHT]
    This is useful for blobs and other simple headless creatures that don't have brains, since they will die then when they lose a functional tissue in this part.
    [BP:UB:body:bodies][UPPERBODY][LOWERBODY][THOUGHT][CATEGORY:BODY]
        [DEFAULT_RELSIZE:2000]

--------------------------------------------------
Can anybody test if adding [THOUGHT] tag to BASIC_1PARTBODY and other upper and lower body definitions would make blob-like creatures of a newly generated world killable? Maybe some creatures just use BASIC_1PARTBODY when they are supposed to use BASIC_1PARTBODY_THOUGHT? Shouldn't all upper bodies be considered a vital organ on its own through some tag in the raws? What tags besides [THOUGHT] have that effect?
(0007074)
derigo   
2010-05-20 09:24   
Upperbodies are normally vital organs because they are large relative to other body parts, they contain most of the other internal organs, and as such are able to bleed a lot. The problem is that with creatures that don't bleed to death or don't feel pain, none of this really matters.

The upperbody is also the 'root' body part. Everything is attached to it. As such it can't be 'severed'. So an upperbody with [THOUGHT] on a creature that doesn't bleed, feel pain, and stuff like that results in an unkillable creature. There's no way to obliterate body parts, the best you can do is cut them off. Toady said he temporarily added a sort of HP system to these sorts of creatures, but apparently its not working as well as he'd hoped.
(0007123)
Another   
2010-05-21 04:39   
I got it that only undead were granted a temporary supplementary hit point system and it works almost perfectly for them. (caveat is that nobody is considered the killer of the creature when it dies through this mechanism.)

The comments inside those cited raw definitions are not mine and IMHO they suggest that second-body-based creatures (_with_ THOUGHT) should be killable unlike first-body-based creatures. What actually went into the game may be different, so I suggest to conduct some empirical tests to clarify.

I suspect that when there is no tag to tell the game that this particular body part is important - when it looses its function (description goes red) the game doesn't know that the creature is effectively dead. (red brain - should be instant braindeath (probably is in the current version for creatures that have brains), blob-like creatures should have their whole main body marked as vital, elementals should probably have something vital too in the absence of "brains" organ.)
(0007223)
toybasher   
2010-05-23 14:53   
AlsoBODY:BASIC_1PARTBODY_THOUGHT]
looks like a typo,

someone try changing it to BODY:BASIC_1PARTBODY_[THOUGHT]

or somthing like that, it looks almost like a typo how its all together without a [
(0007224)
toybasher   
2010-05-23 14:54   
(edited on: 2010-05-26 11:45)
and killing blows have ben removed,

A shame really, before even with a whip you were garanteed some sort of kills.

And by the way, most adventeurers start with "superhuman" on most stats.

This causes punches to be enough to stop organ function (cyan) with just one punch. (I have one right now with averge strength and his punches cause yellow organ damage)
(0007343)
Footkerchief   
2010-05-26 09:24   
Toybasher, just like on the forums, you can edit your notes to add additional sentences instead of posting three notes in a row.
(0007347)
toybasher   
2010-05-26 11:43   
Really? Thanks.
(0008056)
Nikinyo   
2010-06-10 10:13   
Titan made of ice came to my fort, got beaten by my swordsdwarwes (hands and mandibles chopped off, all body parts red), refused to die. When I got tired of watching the endless battle, I had my miners dig under a hill and make a ceiling hanging on one tile. Then I lured the beast under it and collapsed it on monster's head. Cave-ins can kill unkillable creatures.
(0008060)
Quietust   
2010-06-10 10:38   
To those that have mentioned "sever on breaks" not working, it seems that [SEVERONBREAKS] was removed entirely. If there is any mechanism remaining for making broken parts instantly sever, it's probably part of the material properties, and it would seem that it isn't working as intended.
(0008326)
Kyle_Solo   
2010-06-13 14:30   
Forgotten beast made from vomit came to my fort. This was probably the 5th major beast attack I'd dealt with, so I was ready. My military quickly started working on it, cut off several limbs... but it wouldn't die. They fought on, and eventually broke every bone in its body (or at least every part was either red or gone), but it still wouldn't die.

I also tried a controlled cave in on its head, but it moved right before the collapse.

After the last of my military was killed (they beat on it without getting hit for a long time, it wasn't a close fight at all,) I released a caged untamed dragon near it, in the hopes that dragonfire aimed at my dwarves would hit the beast too... the fire hit the vomit-beast many times, but nothing happened (that made me a little sad... I really hoped that the dragonfire would work and my dwarves would be able to tell their children of the time when they tricked a dragon into killing one of their foes!)

So basically it was unkillable, even with dragonfire.
(0008418)
smjjames   
2010-06-14 10:38   
(edited on: 2010-06-14 10:58)
Bronze Colossi are still unkillable in .06. I was messing around in the arena last night and made the mistake of making two bronze colossi. I was playing around with different material scourges. At one point my opponent ended up with an absolute deathgrip on my arm which I couldn't even escape. Had to use a fish to create a slade weapon or two, and even those were ineffective at killing my opponent, who had red everything by then. Decided to exit the arena since that wasn't going anywhere.

Both noses, an ear, a toe, and a thumb did get whacked off between us though.

The other materialmen are still tough to kill, but killable. It just takes something larger or a good weapon to rip them apart and a long enough fall will kill them.

Interestingly, a long fall off the walkway of the northernmost section of the northeast quadrant of the arena doesn't kill Grimelings, even multiple times. Which actually makes sense given that they are a mass of plant material. Tried to make another grimeling to take out the one that I was trying to kill (was doing testing for another bug), which didn't work, so I ended up using a hydra to tear them apart.
(0009024)
Quietust   
2010-06-23 14:11   
(edited on: 2010-06-24 09:23)
I've got an extremely buffed Adventurer (multi-legendary) who's fought several bronze colossuses and has failed to kill any of them. Blunt attacks (using an exceptional bronze maul or great axe) are able to "shatter" every body part dozens of times over but cannot do anything else, while slicing attacks (exceptional bronze great axe) simply glance off. A masterwork Adamantine long sword (liberated from a demonic tower which turned out to be completely uninhabited - no zombies/skeletons, no demons, no nothing) was able to hack off arms and feet (and ears and noses) but only "fracture" other body parts (again, dozens of times over), still incapable of actually killing the damn things.

Upon acquiring a masterwork adamantine two-handed sword, I was finally able to cut off a bronze colossus's head and kill it (after dozens of other "fracture" attacks).
(0009208)
Toady One   
2010-06-28 05:43   
The fluid creatures with broken away bodies and the headless material-based creatures should be handled now. I've still got some more to do here, but it is underway.
(0009265)
Misterstone   
2010-06-28 13:27   
Awesome!
(0009504)
ChickenLips   
2010-07-02 02:22   
(edited on: 2010-07-02 02:26)
Excellent! I just hit this too -- an FB made of water.

(It may be irrelevant at this point, since it'll be fixed shortly, but I tried it and DFHack + zapping the nasty bugger with magma and water worked like a charm.)
(0009961)
smjjames   
2010-07-11 14:30   
I think this is pretty much fixed since Bronze Collossi are killable now, they're still incredibly tough to kill, but still killable.
(0011068)
greycat   
2010-07-26 05:53   
I killed a forgotten beast made of salt in .11. A single crossbow bolt took it out, in fact (although the dwarf in question was seriously wounded right before the bolt struck, and later died in the Hospital). It left behind a smear of salt, and an 11999 weight-unit "beastname's salt" in lieu of a corpse.
(0011183)
RiceMunk   
2010-07-28 07:06   
I've managed to kill, among other things, a fleshball and a forgotten beast made out of water.
Has anyone managed to encounter anything truly unkillable anymore?
(0011427)
InsanityPrelude   
2010-08-02 21:47   
I recently had an unlucky civilian get into combat with a bronze colossus... the BC was unscratched, but I expected that. What I didn't expect was the dwarf to still be alive, not even leaving a blood trail, with so many red, yellow and cyan parts. And when I drafted said dwarf (thinking maybe if she tried to fight back she'd actually die) she was up and fighting, I'm pretty sure with mangled legs.

Meanwhile, dwarves tried to bring her food, ran away when they saw the BC, tried to go back and get the dropped food...
(0011555)
greycat   
2010-08-06 12:40   
I think Toady's fix for forgotten beasts made out of inorganic stuff is broken in the other direction now. Any time I shoot a forgotten beast made out of salt, mud, flames, etc. it always dies after just one hit to the body. Surely they shouldn't be *that* fragile.

Forgotten beasts made out of traditional materials like bones and meat seem to be OK. They're much tougher, but not unkillable.
(0011845)
knofbath   
2010-08-17 01:38   
Turns out bronze colossi still can't be killed by blunt weapons...

They have the tag [NO_THOUGHT_CENTER_FOR_MOVEMENT], meaning no brain to kill I figure. Primary cause of death from blunt weapons is trauma to the internal organs, bronze colossi have no internal organs, thus can't be killed by any blunt weapons. Need a steel or better edged weapon to kill them.
(0012424)
Kon   
2010-09-05 10:06   
Tick composed of dendritic agate can't be killed (.31.12). Head, body, all ten legs, and 7 of 10 feet are all broken and cut open. Only trunk and 3 feet are not. It has 98 bolts stuck in. At least it has been good Marksdwarf practice.
(0012824)
vadia   
2010-09-19 13:34   
Probably instead of a bug one needs to be able to world edit -- megabeasts nigh unkillable 0/1
(0016761)
Granite26   
2011-03-29 07:51   
Is this still around?
(0017027)
Kogut   
2011-04-03 14:21   
http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=80784.msg2145936#msg2145936 [^]

.25: group of badgers is able to kill elephant

"From what I see of how the death by nibbling works, the elephant very quickly starts to slow down due to "extreme pain", and then becomes exhausted very fast, and slips into a coma it never wakes up from. "
(0017673)
Jorshamo   
2011-05-09 13:29   
As far as Bronze Colossuses go, they are killable. I ahd a 10 dwarf squad wail on for for about 30 pages on combat logs, until one got a strike on the head and killed it. This was with Masterwork Steel Axes/Swords, in .25.
(0020547)
Kogut   
2012-02-23 09:27   
related to 0004856
(0020581)
LogicalDash   
2012-02-23 19:41   
I've got a cave crocodile that's had five dwarves pummeling it ever since its first kill.

Said first kill has now rotted to a skeleton.

The croc's head and torso have been torn open. All its toes are smashed. Its teeth are missing--well, I'm not sure it's all of them. It can't really fight, it just won't *die*.

I didn't think that creatures like that were randomly generated, but everything else about the croc resembles this bug, so here I report.
(0021435)
G-Flex   
2012-03-13 02:56   
Cumulative damage resulting in total destruction seems to work fine enough for hard materials (e.g. that of a bronze colossus), but not so much for softer stuff like flesh. For instance, just try killing a vampire giant sponge; it'll never happen no matter how long you tear into it. There's a similar situation where fire never really fully destroys a layer of tissue either.
(0021938)
thvaz   
2012-03-31 05:44   
Tested as is in the summary : 4 legendary dwarves against a bronze colossus.
The colossus died very fast.
Bronze Colussu vs Bronze Colossus - it takes a long time but one of them is always killed.
The crocodile report above I assume the dwarves were punching it, as the posted does not say they were armed. If they were, they would make short work of it. I don't believe I could kill a crocodile in real life by punching it, does not matter for how long :D
I call for a closing of this bug. Individual problems should be reported individually (husks and undeads for example)
(0021940)
Footkerchief   
2012-03-31 07:40   
What about fleshballs?
(0021942)
thvaz   
2012-03-31 08:02   
(edited on: 2012-03-31 08:04)
I tested...and a dwarf killed it in one blow. (with a iron axe this time)

edit: the grimeling too, very easily killed.
(0022030)
Footkerchief   
2012-04-02 09:28   
Okay, thanks for the testing. Due to the large number of related reports, I'm not going to resolve this report immediately -- need to think about how to shuffle stuff around.
(0022031)
NW_Kohaku   
2012-04-02 09:47   
I posted this in the bug voting thread, but it should probably be repeated here:

I believe this is a case of an improperly defined sort of bug report - the skeletal creatures are gone now, for one thing. Bronze Colossus was somewhat nerfed.

The things that made those particular creatures nearly impossible to kill, however, are still in play. They just work on newer creatures, like Giant Sponges, and thralls.

That is to say, in the absence of internal organ damage or bleeding being lethal, severs are still the only way to kill certain creatures, and large enough (or one-body-part) creatures are still basically impossible to destroy.

Skeletal creatures may be gone, and zombies may now have hit point based destruction, but the underlying problem that caused Toady to have to add those hit points is the problem that still lingers on in thralls today.

Even things like sponges and thralls are killable (by air-drowning or by burning them to death), but any dwarf that goes off to fight a giant sponge is probably going to die of starvation trying to kill it, and they will not be retrievable or commanded to retreat by the player. (Which may be a bug in and of itself.)

Screenshot of combat reports with giant sponges being repeatedly "torn apart", but still taking no meaningful damage: http://i40.tinypic.com/34ru5p4.png [^]

Hence, I believe the best way to deal with this would be to say that the title of this bug report should be changed to something that doesn't name specific creatures, just the types of creatures that cause this problem - creatures that do not have blood or rely upon organs and cannot be bisected by normal means are functionally immune to damage that dwarves can directly inflict, and dwarves will be locked into combat until they die of thirst.
(0022035)
Footkerchief   
2012-04-02 11:58   
Combat starvation is covered at 0002290. I'm still deciding how to clean up this report.
(0025215)
sirdeimos   
2014-07-08 19:17   
I had to spend 6 full pages of combat bashing a passed out cyclops in the head with my bronze mace to kill it.
(0026944)
thvaz   
2014-07-19 07:44   
Did some test in the arena, a human fighting a cyclops with a silver mace. The human had some skill and a silver mace, very fast I hit his head and he got stunned...then after some more strikes in the head he gets unconscious...after that it did take some time to kill him with heavy strikes at the head, the human even got tire, but he was kiiled. He even started bleeding in the head after some strikes.
I think it is appropriate. Cyclops are very big creatures, and maces aren't the better weapon to kill them as they are very meaty. A spear would make very shor work of it.
This report should be considered for closing. We don't have any immortal creatures any more, just some very hard to kill (as it should be)
(0027119)
lethosor   
2014-07-21 05:11   
Cyclops weren't mentioned earlier as being impossible to kill - can you test creatures that were mentioned in the initial report (bronze colossuses, flesh balls) as well?
(0027126)
thvaz   
2014-07-21 06:26   
I tested a cyclops because it was mentioned in the comment above...the other were already possible to kill in earlier version, I had tested them already. I will test again to be sure though
(0027128)
thvaz   
2014-07-21 06:47   
Bronze Colossus - Killed 5 times in 5 by an Grandmaster Dwarf with a adamantine axe.
A dwarf without skill with the same equipment was alweays killed, though I think this is expected. Bronze Colossus should be hard to kill, but not impossible.
Fleshball - Always killed even by unskileed dwarves, usually in one strike.
Giant Sponge - other contender, killed easily by unskilled dwarves with cutting weapons
Undead - Killed (not so easily)
The fact is, after pulping, there isn't any creature impossible to kill anymore. In fact pulping should be toned down a bit in my opinion.
(0027129)
thvaz   
2014-07-21 06:48   
Dwarf 1 hacks Bronze Colossus 1 in the lower body with his adamantine battle axe and it is mostly cut away from the rest of the torso!
Bronze Colossus 1 has been struck down.
(0027337)
SirPenguin   
2014-07-23 11:41   
The "unkillable" part is fixed, but I'm wondering if there's still an issue with this

In testing with a Bronze Colossus, I could not harm it *at all* (all body parts listed as white) without Adamantine. Even a squad of 10+ High Master dwarves armed with Steel Battleaxes could not so much as scratch it

It may be a question of balance, but I do think that some critters are *effectively* unable to be killed in this version. Maybe that's intended, and maybe it's limited to just the Bronze Colossus
(0027340)
thvaz   
2014-07-23 12:14   
(edited on: 2014-07-23 12:25)
Adamantine kill them very fast in Arena. Didn't tested with steel, but I will. Well, it is a megabeast, it isn't supposed to be easy to kill after all.

edit 1:I must be doing something wrong, with steel it was killed in a second by 10 Skilled dwarves without armor.

edit 2:A single dwarf controlled by me, legendary and using just a steel battle axe and shield, killed one bronze colossus in 4 strikes:

You hack Bronze Colossus 3 in the right upper arm with your steel battle axe, denting it!
Bronze Colossus 3 misses You!
Bronze Colossus 3 misses You!
Bronze Colossus 3 misses You!
You hack Bronze Colossus 3 in the lower body with your steel battle axe, denting it!
Bronze Colossus 3 misses You!
You strap the steel battle axe to your Upper body.
You strap the steel shield to your Upper body.
You draw the steel battle axe with your Right hand.
You draw the steel shield with your Left hand.
Bronze Colossus 3 misses You!
You attack Bronze Colossus 3 but It jumps away!
Bronze Colossus 3 misses You!
You hack Bronze Colossus 3 in the lower body with your steel battle axe, denting it!
Bronze Colossus 3 attacks You but You jump away!
Bronze Colossus 3 charges at You!
You jump away!
Bronze Colossus 3 misses You!
You hack Bronze Colossus 3 in the lower body with your steel battle axe and it is mostly cut away from the rest of the torso!
Bronze Colossus 3 has been struck down.
(0027659)
ArmokGoB   
2014-07-26 19:07   
I think the pulping mechanic did away with this bug.
(0027672)
SirPenguin   
2014-07-26 22:24   
My mistake, thvaz, you're right. I went back to my own gamelog.txt and it seems I somehow switched to using iron when testing

So, steel + piercing or slashing seems to be the name of the game. steel axes, short swords, even steel spears do the trick. iron glances away for all weapons

anything blunt is useless, no matter the material or skill of the wielder, it cannot even scratch him.

but yeah, that seems more like a balance thing than a bug. i agree, this bug seems totally fixed thanks to pulping and other combat/material changes. that's cool.
(0027895)
Toady One   
2014-07-29 13:08   
I'll go ahead and mark this off for 0.40.01, and we'll continue to work on related issue and balance as we go.