Dwarf Fortress Bug Tracker - Dwarf Fortress
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IDProjectCategoryView StatusDate SubmittedLast Update
0000783Dwarf FortressDwarf Mode -- Tradepublic2010-04-08 01:572014-02-05 10:38
ReporterJiri Petru 
Assigned ToFootkerchief 
PrioritylowSeveritytrivialReproducibilitysometimes
StatusacknowledgedResolutionopen 
PlatformOSOS Version
Product Version 
Target VersionFixed in Version 
Summary0000783: Elves buy and sell products with IMPLIES_ANIMAL_KILL due to JUSTIFIED_IF_SELF_DEFENSE
DescriptionNot sure if this is not a feature, but I report it to be sure.
Elves now have no trouble buying or even selling things made of plants and animals. I sold them my gazella wares and they didn't even flinch.
Steps To Reproduce
Additional Information
TagsNo tags attached.
Relationships
has duplicate 0003236resolved Footkerchief Elves accept items with [IMPLIES_ANIMAL_KILL] 
has duplicate 0004441resolved Footkerchief Elven traders ask for leather items. 
related to 0002545new  Traders won't accept stolen goods from a different civilization, but will request those goods in a counteroffer 
Attached Files
Issue History
Date ModifiedUsernameFieldChange
2010-04-08 01:57Jiri PetruNew Issue
2010-04-08 02:47kaosdrachenNote Added: 0001987
2010-04-08 10:01Jiri PetruNote Added: 0002068
2010-04-10 11:59kaefermelderNote Added: 0002623
2010-04-10 12:00kaefermelderTag Attached: CLOSE THIS
2010-04-10 12:00kaefermelderTag Attached: Not a bug
2010-04-11 00:22FootkerchiefNote Added: 0002741
2010-04-11 11:10FootkerchiefIssue Monitored: Footkerchief
2010-05-01 04:48Jiri PetruNote Added: 0005809
2010-05-01 12:26FootkerchiefNote Added: 0005842
2010-05-01 12:26FootkerchiefTag Detached: CLOSE THIS
2010-05-01 12:26FootkerchiefTag Detached: Not a bug
2010-05-01 12:26FootkerchiefTag Attached: Intentional?
2010-07-12 12:03FootkerchiefTag RenamedIntentional? => Intentional/Expected?
2011-04-03 20:23FootkerchiefRelationship addedhas duplicate 0003236
2011-04-03 20:23FootkerchiefRelationship addedrelated to 0004441
2011-04-03 20:30Logical2uNote Added: 0017037
2011-04-04 07:09BishopXNote Added: 0017055
2011-04-04 09:48FootkerchiefRelationship replacedhas duplicate 0004441
2011-04-04 09:51FootkerchiefTag Detached: Intentional/Expected?
2011-04-04 09:52FootkerchiefRelationship addedrelated to 0002545
2011-04-04 10:38BishopXNote Edited: 0017055bug_revision_view_page.php?bugnote_id=0017055#r6360
2014-02-04 14:52QuietustNote Added: 0024496
2014-02-05 10:38FootkerchiefSummaryElves happily trade leather, bone crafts, etc. => Elves buy and sell products with IMPLIES_ANIMAL_KILL due to JUSTIFIED_IF_SELF_DEFENSE
2014-02-05 10:38FootkerchiefAssigned To => Footkerchief
2014-02-05 10:38FootkerchiefStatusnew => acknowledged
2018-04-13 13:09HuntthetrollIssue Monitored: Huntthetroll

Notes
(0001987)
kaosdrachen   
2010-04-08 02:47   
I'm pretty sure the only stuff they objected to in the 0.2x series was anything that had to consume wood at some point during its creation process - IE, wooden anything, rock short swords (needs a wooden plank to attach the obsidian to), and clear glass anything (need pearlash, which can only be made from ash, which means burning a log).

I've sold tons and tons of leather, bone and plant fiber cloth goods to them over the years with nary an objection.
(0002068)
Jiri Petru   
2010-04-08 10:01   
Not a bug then, I guess.

Strange, I thought I couldn't offer animal products to elves, and always took care not even to sell an item with animal blood spatter. Does it mean I've been needlessly complicating my game for the past few years?
(0002623)
kaefermelder   
2010-04-10 11:59   
[No animal stuff] was before 0.28.181.40d. Elves were changed a lot, in the 0.28.181.40 series, I think. Anyway, nothing new basically, only wood and related was and is not tradeable. No bug.
(0002741)
Footkerchief   
2010-04-11 00:22   
Was it ever confirmed that the 40d behavior wasn't a bug? I'm not sure one way or the other.
(0005809)
Jiri Petru   
2010-05-01 04:48   
I had noticed there's a [IMPLIES_ANIMAL_KILL] tag in the raws. I immediately thought it was for the elves to know I killed an animal. Is there possibly a different use for this tag, or does it mean the tag doesn't work?
(0005842)
Footkerchief   
2010-05-01 12:26   
^^^ I thought the same thing about that tag.
(0017037)
Logical2u   
2011-04-03 20:30   
Based on 0004441 it sounds like this might not be happening any more, or at least as much. Is there any consistent evidence to suggest it's still around?
(0017055)
BishopX   
2011-04-04 07:09   
(edited on: 2011-04-04 10:38)
I can confirm this still occurs in .25.
(0024496)
Quietust   
2014-02-04 14:52   
The reason Elves are willing to trade animal products is because their ethic response for KILL_ANIMAL is set to JUSTIFIED_IF_SELF_DEFENSE - if set to MISGUIDED, SHUN, APPALLING, PUNISH_REPRIMAND, PUNISH_SERIOUS, PUNISH_EXILE, PUNISH_CAPITAL, or UNTHINKABLE, they will refuse to trade it. The same logic is also used for KILL_PLANT for refusing to trade wooden objects (and not bringing caravan wagons).

This "bug" was likely introduced in version 0.28.181.39a with the addition of ethics.