0008264: Food & drinks disappearing from "z"-menu, dwarves are starving

(0030053)
Footkerchief (manager)
2014-09-09 06:40

Need a lot more details. Are the food objects still visible in the gameplay map? Could they have been destroyed by heat/cold? What happens if you produce more food?

Please upload a save that demonstrates the problem to http://dffd.wimbli.com/ [^] and post the link here.

(0030054)
R4FKEN (reporter)
2014-09-09 06:56

Food objects are not visible, anywhere. They just disappeared.
Heat/cold isn't possible as far I know, I'm in a moderate climate and I have been in this fort for over 5 years now without any problems.
I'm not sure what happens with the food I am producing now, I've included a savegame where I am just starting with:
1) Preparing easy meals (have set all seeds to "cook" just now, as the fruit etc. have disappeared).
2) Cleaning fish (the raw fish have not disappeared, but need to be prepared to be considered food afaik).

I cannot seem to access the DFFD from where I am now, so I have uploaded the savegame to my Dropbox, link: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/0t7ljg8cnoq1fnl/AAApD_ej-9zTQ0rWQusHjw01a?dl=0 [^]

(0030057)
R4FKEN (reporter)
2014-09-09 08:08

Half an hour further in the savegame (at very low fps, fwiw) it seems that less and less dwarves are starving/hungry, so I guess food production is going well...

(0030059)
Footkerchief (manager)
2014-09-09 09:31

Is there reason to think that the food wasn't simply eaten?

(0030060)
R4FKEN (reporter)
2014-09-09 09:34

Oh yes, I should have mentioned that: I had about 2000+ prepared lavish meals, and about 600+ drinks, and the timeperiod (real life) can be at max. (about) 0,5 hours.

(0030067)
R4FKEN (reporter)
2014-09-09 12:46

feedback given (think something went wrong here)

(0030068)
Footkerchief (manager)
2014-09-09 13:34
edited on: 2014-09-09 13:36

Where did they disappear from? Were they in barrels in a stockpile? Food rots quickly when not stored properly.

It's going to be hard to figure out what happened unless you have more details or a save that demonstrates the disappearance in progress.

(0030069)
R4FKEN (reporter)
2014-09-09 14:34
edited on: 2014-09-09 14:35

They were stored in barrels in stockpiles, yes. The barrels are still there as far as I know.

I'm sorry I don't have any more details for you, but I'll try to get together the same amounts of food/drink and see if that causes it to happen again.

(0030070)
smjjames (reporter)
2014-09-09 14:45

What about vermin? An unchecked vermin population could do that.

(0030077)
Loci (manager)
2014-09-10 06:15

Note how your "everything" stockpile is filled to capacity, and many tiles have more than one item? The problem is that food turns over (gets replaced) regularly, while mechanisms, bins, and cages do not. So once your stockpile was completely full, your dwarves hauled half-filled food barrels out to pick up newly-created food, then left the entire barrel of food to rot outside the stockpile since there were no empty stockpile tiles. You can see this in the save: a plant barrel was abandoned in the plump helmet field because there wasn't room in the stockpile to store it. There is also a (now) empty barrel by the dimple cup field which probably once held your fortress's foodstuffs. This problem naturally wouldn't manifest until after you'd created enough goods to completely fill your "everything" stockpile.

The only way to guarantee sufficient stockpile space for food is to not allow your dwarves to place anything else in the tile; I would highly suggest separate food and drink stockpiles.

(0030079)
smjjames (reporter)
2014-09-10 06:46

Yeah, the only times that I have an 'everything' stockpile is initially when I'm moving everything in from the wagon until I have proper stockpiles set up for different categories.

(0030087)
R4FKEN (reporter)
2014-09-10 09:25

Thanks for the explanation, will be making separate stockpiles now!

(0030089)
Footkerchief (manager)
2014-09-10 11:04

Sounds like it's solved, please reopen if there's still a bug here.

Issue History
Date Modified	Username	Field	Change
2014-09-09 05:40	R4FKEN	New Issue
2014-09-09 06:40	Footkerchief	Note Added: 0030053
2014-09-09 06:40	Footkerchief	Assigned To	=> Footkerchief
2014-09-09 06:40	Footkerchief	Status	new => needs feedback
2014-09-09 06:56	R4FKEN	Note Added: 0030054
2014-09-09 06:56	R4FKEN	Status	needs feedback => assigned
2014-09-09 08:08	R4FKEN	Note Added: 0030057
2014-09-09 09:31	Footkerchief	Note Added: 0030059
2014-09-09 09:34	R4FKEN	Note Added: 0030060
2014-09-09 09:39	Footkerchief	Status	assigned => needs feedback
2014-09-09 12:46	R4FKEN	Note Added: 0030067
2014-09-09 12:46	R4FKEN	Status	needs feedback => assigned
2014-09-09 13:34	Footkerchief	Note Added: 0030068
2014-09-09 13:35	Footkerchief	Status	assigned => needs feedback
2014-09-09 13:36	Footkerchief	Note Edited: 0030068	View Revisions
2014-09-09 14:34	R4FKEN	Note Added: 0030069
2014-09-09 14:34	R4FKEN	Status	needs feedback => assigned
2014-09-09 14:35	R4FKEN	Note Edited: 0030069	View Revisions
2014-09-09 14:45	smjjames	Note Added: 0030070
2014-09-10 06:15	Loci	Note Added: 0030077
2014-09-10 06:46	smjjames	Note Added: 0030079
2014-09-10 09:25	R4FKEN	Note Added: 0030087
2014-09-10 11:04	Footkerchief	Note Added: 0030089
2014-09-10 11:04	Footkerchief	Status	assigned => resolved
2014-09-10 11:04	Footkerchief	Resolution	open => no change required
2014-09-13 12:47	Footkerchief	Relationship added	duplicate of 0005711
2014-09-13 12:47	Footkerchief	Resolution	no change required => duplicate

Notes
(0030053) Footkerchief (manager) 2014-09-09 06:40	Need a lot more details. Are the food objects still visible in the gameplay map? Could they have been destroyed by heat/cold? What happens if you produce more food? Please upload a save that demonstrates the problem to http://dffd.wimbli.com/ [^] and post the link here.

(0030054) R4FKEN (reporter) 2014-09-09 06:56	Food objects are not visible, anywhere. They just disappeared. Heat/cold isn't possible as far I know, I'm in a moderate climate and I have been in this fort for over 5 years now without any problems. I'm not sure what happens with the food I am producing now, I've included a savegame where I am just starting with: 1) Preparing easy meals (have set all seeds to "cook" just now, as the fruit etc. have disappeared). 2) Cleaning fish (the raw fish have not disappeared, but need to be prepared to be considered food afaik). I cannot seem to access the DFFD from where I am now, so I have uploaded the savegame to my Dropbox, link: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/0t7ljg8cnoq1fnl/AAApD_ej-9zTQ0rWQusHjw01a?dl=0 [^]

(0030057) R4FKEN (reporter) 2014-09-09 08:08	Half an hour further in the savegame (at very low fps, fwiw) it seems that less and less dwarves are starving/hungry, so I guess food production is going well...

(0030059) Footkerchief (manager) 2014-09-09 09:31	Is there reason to think that the food wasn't simply eaten?

(0030060) R4FKEN (reporter) 2014-09-09 09:34	Oh yes, I should have mentioned that: I had about 2000+ prepared lavish meals, and about 600+ drinks, and the timeperiod (real life) can be at max. (about) 0,5 hours.

(0030067) R4FKEN (reporter) 2014-09-09 12:46	feedback given (think something went wrong here)

(0030068) Footkerchief (manager) 2014-09-09 13:34 edited on: 2014-09-09 13:36	Where did they disappear from? Were they in barrels in a stockpile? Food rots quickly when not stored properly. It's going to be hard to figure out what happened unless you have more details or a save that demonstrates the disappearance in progress.

(0030069) R4FKEN (reporter) 2014-09-09 14:34 edited on: 2014-09-09 14:35	They were stored in barrels in stockpiles, yes. The barrels are still there as far as I know. I'm sorry I don't have any more details for you, but I'll try to get together the same amounts of food/drink and see if that causes it to happen again.

(0030070) smjjames (reporter) 2014-09-09 14:45	What about vermin? An unchecked vermin population could do that.

(0030077) Loci (manager) 2014-09-10 06:15	Note how your "everything" stockpile is filled to capacity, and many tiles have more than one item? The problem is that food turns over (gets replaced) regularly, while mechanisms, bins, and cages do not. So once your stockpile was completely full, your dwarves hauled half-filled food barrels out to pick up newly-created food, then left the entire barrel of food to rot outside the stockpile since there were no empty stockpile tiles. You can see this in the save: a plant barrel was abandoned in the plump helmet field because there wasn't room in the stockpile to store it. There is also a (now) empty barrel by the dimple cup field which probably once held your fortress's foodstuffs. This problem naturally wouldn't manifest until after you'd created enough goods to completely fill your "everything" stockpile. The only way to guarantee sufficient stockpile space for food is to not allow your dwarves to place anything else in the tile; I would highly suggest separate food and drink stockpiles.

(0030079) smjjames (reporter) 2014-09-10 06:46	Yeah, the only times that I have an 'everything' stockpile is initially when I'm moving everything in from the wagon until I have proper stockpiles set up for different categories.

(0030087) R4FKEN (reporter) 2014-09-10 09:25	Thanks for the explanation, will be making separate stockpiles now!

(0030089) Footkerchief (manager) 2014-09-10 11:04	Sounds like it's solved, please reopen if there's still a bug here.